MICHEL MARTIN, HOST:
In September of 2020, a man was caught filming up women's skirts at a supermarket in southeastern France. What happened next would change Gisele Pelicot's life forever and make headlines around the world. And here is where we need to let you know that this next story is about sexual assault.
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UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER #1: Tonight, a story so shocking it redefines the meaning...
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER #2: Gisele Pelicot (speaking Spanish).
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER #3: Dominique Pelicot (speaking French).
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ELEANOR BEARDSLEY: Dominique Pelicot recruited men on an internet site to come rape his drugged, unconscious wife. He directed the participants and filmed it all.
MARTIN: In December of 2024, Dominique Pelicot was found guilty of all charges and received the maximum sentence of 20 years. The 50 other defendants were also found guilty of rape or other sex crimes. Another 21 men on the tapes were never identified. But what also drew the attention of the world was not just the horrifying nature of the crime, but that Gisele Pelicot demanded that the trial be open to the public. Her refusal to be shamed or silenced has gone beyond her own trial and become a mission on behalf of other survivors. She writes about all of this in her new book, "A Hymn To Life." She spoke with me from Paris through an interpreter, and I started by asking about the first conversation she had with the police.
GISELE PELICOT: (Through interpreter) Lieutenant Perret shows me photos of what Mr. Pelicot had done to me, and I just don't recognize that woman. I don't recognize the place. And then it hit me like a high-speed train. I just couldn't fathom that Mr. Pelicot could have done those things to me.
MARTIN: Is it that you literally did not recognize yourself because you had been drugged, or is it that your brain could just not accept that someone you loved and who you thought loved you could do that?
PELICOT: (Through interpreter) I did not recognize that woman. It was like some rag doll disguised. And I didn't recognize the people. Like, my brain just wouldn't, couldn't understand it. My brain dissociated. It took me a long time to actually say the word rape. I couldn't even fathom it.
MARTIN: Do you recall when you were finally able to fathom it?
PELICOT: (Through interpreter) No. It was very, very difficult for me to realize that this was someone I'd spent 50 years with. I only really got to know side A of Mr. Pelicot, where he was kind, but I never really got to know the side B of him that was not. It was very difficult.
MARTIN: One of the things that I found so moving about the book, you refuse to give up the side of Mr. Pelicot that you knew before - the part of your life that was happy. And I was so struck by that.
PELICOT: (Through interpreter) We had happy times. We were married really young. We had three kids. We had seven grandkids. I can't erase that. What I do try and erase, though, is the darkness of Mr. Pelicot. I try and forget that. But you can't really forget because the scars are indelible.
MARTIN: You chose to have the trial be open. You could have had a closed trial. And in fact, through most of the trial preparation, that had been your plan, and you changed your mind. Why did you decide to open the trial?
PELICOT: (Through interpreter) In the beginning, I did want it to be a closed trial because I was ashamed. It sort of started coming to me little by little. I said to myself that shame needed to change sides. And by having the closed trial, I was giving them a gift. All these men, their names wouldn't have been known and what they did wouldn't have been known. I realized that part of this trial was not just my trial, but this was a trial for all the women who'd suffered sexual violence.
MARTIN: There's a long history of victims of sexual violence being blamed for it or being told that they are complicit in some way. There was the implication that you were a part of some swinger community. How did you cope with that?
PELICOT: (Through interpreter) I experienced total humiliation. I was considered consenting, complicit, a suspect. And all the victims said they weren't guilty. When I was able to speak, I said, I'm the only guilty party here with 50 victims behind me. What saved me is that we had the evidence. We had the proof. Whereas, in a lot of cases, it's the woman's word against the assailant. The accused parties always turn the situation around and say that they're being victimized because they're being accused. I wanted them to be put away for what they did. So that's why I was able to stand tall, be dignified and keep going on because I knew that they were guilty and I was not guilty.
MARTIN: And, of course, the question that remains is why? Why would someone do this to someone, especially someone that they claim to love? Do you think you'll ever have an answer?
PELICOT: (Through interpreter) I don't know if I'll ever have the answer to that question. I choose to move towards the light. Mr. Pelicot, he chose darkness. I was raped over 200 times over 10 years. I had illnesses and had to take antibiotics and even had a procedure at the end of this year. I'm fine now. But how could a human being do something like that to someone who's the love of their life? The question is still open.
MARTIN: You end the book with an extraordinary statement. You write, (reading) I still need to believe in love. I even believe that I knew how to give it. I now know that it comes from a deep wound within me that makes me vulnerable. But I accept that fragility, that risk still to fight the emptiness I need to love.
Where does that come from, this ability to still love? Can you explain it?
PELICOT: (Through interpreter) I think love can save the world. And I've just had the great fortune of being in love again. And I just think that you have to believe. You have to trust. And I think if you don't love, you don't exist. If I don't love, I don't exist. I need to keep on loving. Yeah, I do, indeed.
MARTIN: It's been a great honor and a privilege to speak with you. I think you're extraordinary. And I am so grateful that you survived, and I'm so thankful that you were able to speak with us and to tell your story.
PELICOT: (Through interpreter) I thank you. And I had a great time spending this time with you. Merci beaucoup.
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MARTIN: Tamara McGinnis provided the interpretation for this interview. You can hear my full conversation with Gisele Pelicot on this week's Sunday Story. Find it in your Up First podcast feed.
(SOUNDBITE OF DAVIGNON'S "DUALITIES") Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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